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Talk:Worlds of Hurt
The Caption So there's been a bit of a back and forth regarding the headline quote for this page. Originally, the quote, which comes from the "Chamber of Thrills" comic book cover (seen right) from the Challenge Rooms Downloadable Content, appeared like this: User PapiDimmi objected to the use of capitalization and, later on, the use of underscoring arguing that it's unsightly or that it goes against Wikipedia's manual of style for contributions, and instead offered the following: Now, to the point of this post, I argue that the original was the better option aesthetically, and that while PapiDimmi is correct about the general Wikipedia policy, an individual site such as the BioShock Wiki can and has made policy changes if consensus determines that's what's best. For example, the general policy is to hyperlink at the first mention of a "linkable" word. A while back, the editors here agreed that with quotes, that wasn't a good idea since the link was better suited in the main body of the article. So we changed that rule. Now I'm asking for input from the general contributors: which option looks better, the original one which more closely matches the comic book style of the quote, or the current one which more closely adheres to the Wikipedia Manual of Style? Please share your thoughts and opinions. Unownshipper (talk) 22:20, April 13, 2017 (UTC) :In addition to going against Wikipedia’s Manual of Style, ALL-CAPS and underscore looks very unpleasing to readers. Emphasized text is supposed to catch your attention—but not too much. Boldface is a nice way to emphasize text without making the text stand out too much or be unpleasing to readers. 22:24, April 13, 2017 (UTC) ::I'll buy that it goes against Wikipedia’s Manual of Style as you've demonstrated, but again I'd argue that's not really an issue. This exception would only apply to the Worlds of Hurt, The 'I' in Team, and A Shocking Turn of Events pages as only those three Challenge Rooms levels utilize quotes from sources (the comic books) that bear words in all caps. ::As for the notion that it looks unpleasant, that is utterly subjective. I don't see how it looks bad or good as this is a quote used to create a sense of drama, not an email sent to an office colleague, so it's not as though it's a faux pas to use it in this brief instance. ::Unownshipper (talk) 02:10, April 14, 2017 (UTC) :::The version with the cap letters most closely resembles the source material IMO. And I think it looks much better as well. The bold letters don't cut it for me. sm ::::In addition, by the way, consistency is an important factor. Three articles using all capital letters for emphasis and the rest of the articles on this wiki using boldface, italics, or something else, should definitely be avoided. ::::Here is an article that supports my statement. It says that underlining text certainly draws attention to it, but it’s not so inviting to read. Italic type is meant to emphasize text, and so is boldface. These fonts are so commonly used that it’s odd not to use them. Like I said, underline and all-caps—especially both at the same time—is an awful way to emphasize text, despite how it’s emphasized in the source material, as not only does it look unpleasing, but it also looks very unprofessional, which a wiki should generally try to avoid. As I’ve mentioned before, by the logic that we should follow the source material, the entire quote should be all capital letters, as that’s how it appeared in the original source material. ::::I don’t get to decide how this wiki gets to style its articles, but I could not find anything about text emphasiz in the BioShock wiki’s Manual of Style, so it’s up to you, Unownshipper, what you decide to do with this article. I’m just saying: emphasizing with all-caps or underscore (or both) is the worst way you could emphasize text. 15:11, April 15, 2017 (UTC) :::::Your line of reasoning is edging on pedantic and once again your tone is verging on impertinence. It is not up to me to decide this, it's based on the majority decision of this site's contributors, and I resent you implying otherwise. The point of this section is to talk this out to reach a consensus and that's what I'm trying to do. :::::First of all, I do think that consistency is important, but so too is context. The proposal I'm suggesting is that quotes, specifically the headliner quotes, may be permitted to use all caps when recreating the style from a print or text-based source. Seemingly 97% of the headliner quotes on this Wiki come from Audio Diary entries or people's speeches, so there's NO need to use all caps or other emphasis in those cases as the source material's transcripts don't use them either. That's what I meant when I said that this would only apply to those 3 from the Challenge Rooms as those are the only pages that quote the "Chamber of Thrills" comic book cover. And as I’ve mentioned before, there are plenty of Fonts that use all caps in the uppercase and lowercase format. When you take into consideration that this is a comic book we're talking about (AKA, a medium known for dramatic flare), it seems perfectly likely this is the case. So the excuse that "the entire quote should be all capital letters" is a moot one in my opinion. :::::And while we're on the subject of context, the link you provided appears to be someone's website about professional methods for marketing and branding a company's internal or external communications. This is a fan-based Wiki. The only thing that needs to be professional is the behavior of the contributors. That in no way suggests that we have lax standards for our writing, formatting, or other style guides, but as we document and recreate a game that was NOT beholden to academic or corporate style guides, neither must we. :::::Also, you're using a logical fallacy by arguing against underline and all-caps at the same time because NOBODY was arguing for it to look that way. "Three articles using all capital letters for emphasis and the rest of the articles on this wiki using boldface, italics, or something else, should definitely be avoided." Once again, the subject of this discussion is the Quote Template. None of the other articles on this site use "boldface, italics, or something else" in any significant way. :::::Unownshipper (talk) 06:58, April 16, 2017 (UTC) There is little point in continuing this argument. This is purely based on personal preference. My opinion is to use italics (or boldface, if the text is already italic) for emphasis, as that’s most appealing to readers, as well as commonplace, but if you disagree, you disagree. By the way, my tone may seem serious, but this is the Internet, where most communication is done via text. It’s undoubtedly difficult to tell someone’s tone and emotion when merely reading a piece of text. I haven’t said anything that can be considered rude, as far as I know. The reason I seem insolent is probably my lack of smilies. If I were to use some “tongue out” smilies—or whatever they’re called—you’d probably be able to tell that I’m being audacious or narcissistic, but that’d also make my posts seem much less serious, which I certainly do not want. 10:50, April 16, 2017 (UTC) :All in all, the style guide/Manual of Style we have here is hopelessly outdated. I have been collecting modifications and additions but I haven't been able to put that somewhere properly, nor does it contain information about this anyways. While we have some Wikipedia copypasta BioShock Wiki:Simplified ruleset, we're not Wikipedia, so we're free to choose our own way of doing things. All I can say is that the version with bold text is less readable than the one with full capitals, so I'm inclined to pick the most readable. —'Mainframe98 talk·blog· ' 06:31, April 20, 2017 (UTC) ::Well, you decide, I guess. 22:08, April 20, 2017 (UTC) The Covers So I'm sure we've all noticed that there seem to be two unique "Chamber of Thrills" covers for the Worlds of Hurt challenge. The question is why? Does anyone have any thoughts or observations to offer? Unownshipper (talk) 22:33, April 20, 2017 (UTC) So I just checked and the Xbox 360 version opens with the image on the right as the loading screen, so it's not just a remastered edition change. So that leaves me asking where does the image on the left come from? Unownshipper (talk) 01:54, April 21, 2017 (UTC) :Don't know for sure, but I suspect that the one on the left is an early version/concept of the one they eventually used. The art work is rather basic and lacks detail we usually see in Mr. Water's final works. sm --Solarmech (talk) 11:40, April 21, 2017 (UTC) ::I guess that's possible, it does look like a more simplified version of the in-game comic book; although, for what it's worth, I think the left one looks more like what would be seen on a pulp-style comic of the period than the more detailed one. Regardless, does the left image come from one of Water's resume or portfolio websites? ::Unownshipper (talk) 22:18, April 21, 2017 (UTC) :::I don't see it on Mr. Water's site. I looked around and found some references to the source on the 2K Forums which says it came from the Irrational Blog, which I don't know if it's still online anymore since Irrational changed it's name. sm --Solarmech (talk) 02:38, April 22, 2017 (UTC) :::ARGH! Didn't read things right/far enough. The image came from the Playstation Blog and the page is still up. http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/11/19/bioshock-ps3-dlc-surfaces-tomorrow/ sm --Solarmech (talk) 13:02, April 22, 2017 (UTC)